Well, this is just incredibly disappointing. It's not like I expected a lot, but this undershot that by magnitudes. According to Xcel they are paying me $0.02857/kWh and I generated 680kWhs more than I used last year. So my Solar Rewards for this year are a whopping $19.43. Pays for the mandatory connection fee for two months. So...that just sucks. Once I've done my taxes for this year I'll be able to calculate the actual expected payoff for the solar panels and how much it's saving me a year and all that. With any luck it will be of more value each year for a while as I refine my ability to use less electricity and generate more.
By the way, they are charging me close to twice what they are paying me for electricity. Fuckers.
Showing posts with label xcel. Show all posts
Showing posts with label xcel. Show all posts
Thursday, January 27, 2011
Monday, December 13, 2010
Solar generation Nov 2010
I forgot to post this at the beginning of December so here it is. I generated 700kwh of electricity and I used a total of 0 according to Xcel.
The weird thing is that the last two months the meter for my electricity has slowly but surely gone up. On warm days when it's sunny I make some headway on lowering the number on the meter, but most days I use a bit more than I generate. So I guess the number that Xcel sends me is the total, as in I've generated more electricity total than I've used total this year. That would certainly be true. I really wish I had a better meter so I could keep track of that stuff better. There is some more data in the bill, so maybe I'll go through and compile that and see if it helps at some point.
The weird thing is that the last two months the meter for my electricity has slowly but surely gone up. On warm days when it's sunny I make some headway on lowering the number on the meter, but most days I use a bit more than I generate. So I guess the number that Xcel sends me is the total, as in I've generated more electricity total than I've used total this year. That would certainly be true. I really wish I had a better meter so I could keep track of that stuff better. There is some more data in the bill, so maybe I'll go through and compile that and see if it helps at some point.
Friday, April 9, 2010
Another goal reached! 0 total electricity used from the grid!
I generated more electricity than I used this month. That's much earlier in the year than I expected that to happen. This is a big goal, finally generating more than I'm using, and what I am using is supposed to be from wind sources, although I know that's at least partially bullshit. And once I've had a chance to do some more insulating and whatnot, I should generate more than I use all but 2 or 3 months out of the year except on the coldest winters. Woohoo!
This is how my brain works though....I have signed up for, and pay a premium for, electricity that is 100% generated by wind. But I pull from the grid just like everybody else, so the likelihood of the electrons I'm pulling actually coming from a wind source are pretty minimal since it's all mixed in with the much more predominate source of coal. Well fine, as long as wind is generating sufficient power to cover my usage, it's at least in the system so I'm helping cut down on the amount that has to be generated by coal by subsidizing the wind sources. Except I have no way of knowing that, and I'm positive that Xcel would gladly double dip on anything they thought they could get away with. So while I know they have a shitload of turbines around here, and I have heard they generate a lot of wind energy, there is no real way for me to know if my needs are covered by that source or not. For all I know there are 2000 of us all slotted for that one allotment of wind generated energy, all paying the premium for it, but since it can't really be separated out of the general grid, we're all double booked for it.
But now...now I know where the majority of my electricity is generated. Right on top of my own fucking house, that's where. And if I had the money, I'd buy one of those Phillips house grade UPSs and install that fucker and know that every bit of the electricity I used I generated without ever touching any of Xcels energy. But...I'd have to pay my way out of the contract with Xcel to do that...so it'd cost me something like $23,000 on top of the cost of the UPS and the installation.
So...we'll save that for a day shortly after I win the powerball. Which I don't play, because I understand math too well.
This is how my brain works though....I have signed up for, and pay a premium for, electricity that is 100% generated by wind. But I pull from the grid just like everybody else, so the likelihood of the electrons I'm pulling actually coming from a wind source are pretty minimal since it's all mixed in with the much more predominate source of coal. Well fine, as long as wind is generating sufficient power to cover my usage, it's at least in the system so I'm helping cut down on the amount that has to be generated by coal by subsidizing the wind sources. Except I have no way of knowing that, and I'm positive that Xcel would gladly double dip on anything they thought they could get away with. So while I know they have a shitload of turbines around here, and I have heard they generate a lot of wind energy, there is no real way for me to know if my needs are covered by that source or not. For all I know there are 2000 of us all slotted for that one allotment of wind generated energy, all paying the premium for it, but since it can't really be separated out of the general grid, we're all double booked for it.
But now...now I know where the majority of my electricity is generated. Right on top of my own fucking house, that's where. And if I had the money, I'd buy one of those Phillips house grade UPSs and install that fucker and know that every bit of the electricity I used I generated without ever touching any of Xcels energy. But...I'd have to pay my way out of the contract with Xcel to do that...so it'd cost me something like $23,000 on top of the cost of the UPS and the installation.
So...we'll save that for a day shortly after I win the powerball. Which I don't play, because I understand math too well.
Sunday, November 8, 2009
1 month of solar 10/7/09-11/8/09
I don't yet have a good monitoring solution so I'm going to just do Monthly Total Generation and Maximum Generation stats. So far it's looking good, even without my tree being trimmed so that the solar array is blocked at least partially every day here is what I generated:
Max Generated: 6686 W
Total Generated: 620KWh
So by my calculations from my records, even in winter with my system not receiving all the light it should because of my tree (getting that fixed next week) I am generating about two times more than I use any month of the year that I live by myself. During the summer I will generate a great deal more, and I haven't yet had a chance to use an energy monitor to get rid of the biggest uses of power. So I should be doing really great once the tree is trimmed and I've reduced my electricity usage even further through efficiency.
One thing this doesn't include is the power usage of the hot tub. I've only had it a month and a half and only 2 weeks of that was before the solar was functional. So I'm not sure how much power it is pulling a month. That is one of the things I want to use the energy monitor for. Even with the hot tub I should be generating more than I use every month of the year, and quite a lot more during the summer months. It looks like this plan is going to work out.
I'm not yet sure how to calculate my total savings, there are some confounding factors and I haven't quite come up with an algorithm that will take everything into account. So I may have to wait until I've had the whole set up for an entire year before I can calculate how long it will take for it to pay for itself.
Max Generated: 6686 W
Total Generated: 620KWh
So by my calculations from my records, even in winter with my system not receiving all the light it should because of my tree (getting that fixed next week) I am generating about two times more than I use any month of the year that I live by myself. During the summer I will generate a great deal more, and I haven't yet had a chance to use an energy monitor to get rid of the biggest uses of power. So I should be doing really great once the tree is trimmed and I've reduced my electricity usage even further through efficiency.
One thing this doesn't include is the power usage of the hot tub. I've only had it a month and a half and only 2 weeks of that was before the solar was functional. So I'm not sure how much power it is pulling a month. That is one of the things I want to use the energy monitor for. Even with the hot tub I should be generating more than I use every month of the year, and quite a lot more during the summer months. It looks like this plan is going to work out.
I'm not yet sure how to calculate my total savings, there are some confounding factors and I haven't quite come up with an algorithm that will take everything into account. So I may have to wait until I've had the whole set up for an entire year before I can calculate how long it will take for it to pay for itself.
Wednesday, September 30, 2009
So close!
The hole in the wall is fixed, everything is installed. My understanding is that now I just have to wait for the paperwork to get to Xcel, then I have to start pushing them to install my bi-directional meter. Once that is done, I can start actually using all this equipment I paid so much for.
Friday, September 25, 2009
Woohoo! Solar officiall completely installed!
I have fully inspected and approved solar panels! Assuming they patch the hole in my wall on Monday like they said, I am done with REC Solar. Once all the paperwork is turned in, I start the push to get Xcel to come install the bi-directional meter. I was told "it can take as long as 30 days" up until today when the project manager said "6 weeks, but lately they've been a little faster about it". UGH! So it may be 6 weeks before I get to turn my system on...meanwhile it sits there slowly losing efficiency.
I still can't get Tree Pros to even call me back about taking care of my tree. If they don't contact me today or answer the phone when I call, I'm calling their biggest competitor.
I still can't get Tree Pros to even call me back about taking care of my tree. If they don't contact me today or answer the phone when I call, I'm calling their biggest competitor.
Thursday, September 24, 2009
Nearing the end!
The person that is going to install my inverter is supposed to be on the way to my house right now. All he's got to do is install the inverter, hook it up, connect the last connection on the panels and then test to make sure it works. Then tomorrow the inspection is supposed to happen. Assuming that goes well, they are supposed to close up my wall and be finished. Then it's a matter of getting Xcel out to inspect everything and put in the new bi-directional meter and then I'm producing electricity from sun light! If my calculations are right, I should be producing about twice to three times what I use. Especially once I've got my new efficient refrigerator and dishwasher and gone through the house with a power meter and switched out all the vampiric electronics.
At least, that's what I have planned...by the end of all this I'll be pretty close to entirely out of money so we'll see.
At least, that's what I have planned...by the end of all this I'll be pretty close to entirely out of money so we'll see.
Tuesday, September 15, 2009
Solar electric installation underway!
The REC installation crew showed up yesterday morning and started my solar installation. I had a quick walk-through with the foreman and then left for work. I got home about 4pm so that they could leave on time without leaving my house unlocked, and they'd put in all the conduit for the main power, and had all of the adjustable mounting brackets attached to the roof.
Today they arrived just as I was leaving for work, in a hurry because I had to go to an All-Staff required meeting...yes, one of THOSE. I expect they'll have all the wiring and a good deal of the racking structure in place today. Tomorrow they are supposed to be finished, then the final inspection will happen either tomorrow or Thursday.
Nows the bad news...then I have to wait UP TO 30 DAYS for Xcel to sign off on it and allow me to actually turn the system on. That is...phenomenally annoying.
Next step, once everything is in place, is to get someone out to take care of my black walnut tree. I really don't want to cut it down, but I just don't see any choice. So...I'll get an expert out to try to help me save the tree, and if we can't then I'll plant other trees to make up for it. Or maybe just trellis with vines on it so I don't have to worry about the height of the trees, then plan trees further from the house.
Oh, speaking of which, another nice piece of news...the guy who is going to do my fence for me told me that he thinks it'll be fine to put clinging vines on the fence. He says pretty much all of the fencing he's dealt with, even the really old stuff, shows surface damage from weather and plants but is almost always solid underneath. So my plans for the house/yard are moving right along!
The hot tub is full functional and working great. I'm waiting for the hot tub company to finish the configuration of the electronic controls and bring me my top lifter, but those are minor things now that the hot tub is installed and working. Still lots to do to make the shed a more hot tub friendly place, and in fact I may have to get another 2 rows or so of tile put in, but it's coming along nicely.
Today they arrived just as I was leaving for work, in a hurry because I had to go to an All-Staff required meeting...yes, one of THOSE. I expect they'll have all the wiring and a good deal of the racking structure in place today. Tomorrow they are supposed to be finished, then the final inspection will happen either tomorrow or Thursday.
Nows the bad news...then I have to wait UP TO 30 DAYS for Xcel to sign off on it and allow me to actually turn the system on. That is...phenomenally annoying.
Next step, once everything is in place, is to get someone out to take care of my black walnut tree. I really don't want to cut it down, but I just don't see any choice. So...I'll get an expert out to try to help me save the tree, and if we can't then I'll plant other trees to make up for it. Or maybe just trellis with vines on it so I don't have to worry about the height of the trees, then plan trees further from the house.
Oh, speaking of which, another nice piece of news...the guy who is going to do my fence for me told me that he thinks it'll be fine to put clinging vines on the fence. He says pretty much all of the fencing he's dealt with, even the really old stuff, shows surface damage from weather and plants but is almost always solid underneath. So my plans for the house/yard are moving right along!
The hot tub is full functional and working great. I'm waiting for the hot tub company to finish the configuration of the electronic controls and bring me my top lifter, but those are minor things now that the hot tub is installed and working. Still lots to do to make the shed a more hot tub friendly place, and in fact I may have to get another 2 rows or so of tile put in, but it's coming along nicely.
Monday, June 2, 2008
More Solar information.
This isn't going to be very organized unfortunately. This is information I've received so far by doing more research on the web, talking to Jeff Martin@REC Solar and especially from this great site Solar Dave. He's even offered to interview me once I get my system installed, which would be interesting.
At this point, I'm waiting to get estimates from a few other companies before deciding on what I'm getting installed and by who. And of course...financing. If I can't get financing that suits my current income none of this will be possible. I'm still searching around for options and talking to my incredibly amazing mortgage guy.
So here's a chunk of info:
Getting the rebate through Xcel requires that you sign a 20 year contract of some sort. The implication I've heard/seen so far is that you have to agree not to go off grid or install power storage in your house for 20 years. It makes sense...they are giving a gigantic amount of other peoples money in the solar installation rebates, and that money is given to them with the agreement that they use it to promote renewable energy sources. So basically Xcel is paying me a bunch of money to stay attached to the grid and continue generating energy via my solar panels and putting it back into the grid. I'm ok with that. I'd rather have some sort of storage so that if the grid goes down when the solar isn't producing enough I still have power, but maybe some sort of compromise solution is possible. I'll have to find out from Xcel and from the contract when I see it.
I've seen estimates that having an electric car or plugin hybrid increases your system size by about 1kW. Of course, most of the time you're going to be recharging the car when the solar isn't producing, so the 1kW is an approximation for how much additional power you'll have to generate with the system when the sun is available to offset charging the car at night.
I've been looking at the Kyocera, Sanyo, BP and Mitsubishi panels. This is just my take on things, but it looks to me that the Sanyos are the best of the bunch with the Kyocera and BP panels being tied for second and then the Mitsubishi panels are in last. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure they're all good panels. Here's why I rank them in my mind the way I do:
Sanyo
HIP-195BA are hybrid panels of single crystalline silicon surrounded by amorphous silicon layers. This apparently makes them higher efficiency and gives them the ability to generate energy at lower light levels. If I remember correctly they are more strongly affected by high temperatures, but where I live that isn't a big deal since it doesn't get hot enough to show a difference. Getting comparable efficiency numbers out of the panel makers seems to be somewhat difficult, but these are supposed to be 17% efficient. Higher efficiency means higher energy generation per square foot, so in theory I'm maximizing the amount of power I can generate using higher efficiency panels. The problem being that they are $7.69/DC Watt. The cells are 52"x35"
Kyocera
KD205 GX-LP are polysilicon and have an efficiency of 14.2%. They have a cost of $7.00/DC Watt so quite a bit cheaper than the Sanyos. The cells are 59"x39". So not only are they larger than the Sanyos, they are less efficient.
BP
I haven't looked into these very well, I've been told they are pretty close to the Kyoceras.
Mitsubishi
PV-UO185MFS are 13% efficient, they cost $7.08/DC Watt and are 65"x33". So more expensive, larger and less efficient than the Kyoceras. Apparently people that buy them are buying them for the name.
Xcels rebate is $4.50/Watt or something like that.
Hmmm...that's all I've got at the moment.
At this point, I'm waiting to get estimates from a few other companies before deciding on what I'm getting installed and by who. And of course...financing. If I can't get financing that suits my current income none of this will be possible. I'm still searching around for options and talking to my incredibly amazing mortgage guy.
So here's a chunk of info:
Getting the rebate through Xcel requires that you sign a 20 year contract of some sort. The implication I've heard/seen so far is that you have to agree not to go off grid or install power storage in your house for 20 years. It makes sense...they are giving a gigantic amount of other peoples money in the solar installation rebates, and that money is given to them with the agreement that they use it to promote renewable energy sources. So basically Xcel is paying me a bunch of money to stay attached to the grid and continue generating energy via my solar panels and putting it back into the grid. I'm ok with that. I'd rather have some sort of storage so that if the grid goes down when the solar isn't producing enough I still have power, but maybe some sort of compromise solution is possible. I'll have to find out from Xcel and from the contract when I see it.
I've seen estimates that having an electric car or plugin hybrid increases your system size by about 1kW. Of course, most of the time you're going to be recharging the car when the solar isn't producing, so the 1kW is an approximation for how much additional power you'll have to generate with the system when the sun is available to offset charging the car at night.
I've been looking at the Kyocera, Sanyo, BP and Mitsubishi panels. This is just my take on things, but it looks to me that the Sanyos are the best of the bunch with the Kyocera and BP panels being tied for second and then the Mitsubishi panels are in last. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure they're all good panels. Here's why I rank them in my mind the way I do:
Sanyo
HIP-195BA are hybrid panels of single crystalline silicon surrounded by amorphous silicon layers. This apparently makes them higher efficiency and gives them the ability to generate energy at lower light levels. If I remember correctly they are more strongly affected by high temperatures, but where I live that isn't a big deal since it doesn't get hot enough to show a difference. Getting comparable efficiency numbers out of the panel makers seems to be somewhat difficult, but these are supposed to be 17% efficient. Higher efficiency means higher energy generation per square foot, so in theory I'm maximizing the amount of power I can generate using higher efficiency panels. The problem being that they are $7.69/DC Watt. The cells are 52"x35"
Kyocera
KD205 GX-LP are polysilicon and have an efficiency of 14.2%. They have a cost of $7.00/DC Watt so quite a bit cheaper than the Sanyos. The cells are 59"x39". So not only are they larger than the Sanyos, they are less efficient.
BP
I haven't looked into these very well, I've been told they are pretty close to the Kyoceras.
Mitsubishi
PV-UO185MFS are 13% efficient, they cost $7.08/DC Watt and are 65"x33". So more expensive, larger and less efficient than the Kyoceras. Apparently people that buy them are buying them for the name.
Xcels rebate is $4.50/Watt or something like that.
Hmmm...that's all I've got at the moment.
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